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New dupuytrens patient Finland
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02/22/2015 19:30
Aku_ 
02/22/2015 19:30
Aku_ 
New dupuytrens patient Finland

Hello All

I am 36 year old male from Helsinki Finland. I am a very active and passionate rock climber.

My story with dupuytrens started 4years ago when a small peasized lump appeared on my right palm on top of the pinky tendon
I watched it for a while and then decided to go show it to a doctor. It was a gp doctor and he, after examining it thought it is a ganglion cyst and said it will probably go away on its on and even if not it should only be treated if it starts bothering me.
So, i forgot about it, the lump did in fact go smaller to the point you cannot see it but definetly can feel it. There is some change of the look of the skin if you know to look for it(kind of a smiley face groove).

Fast forward 4years and another one appeared on my left palm on the middle finger tendon this time. From the experience on my right palm i thought its another ganglion but decided to go show it anyway. The doctor, a GP, thought it was something called DD.
I did not want to believe her and asked if she can try to aspirate it. Aspiration is a procedure for emptying the fluid content of a ganglion by a large needle.Nothing came out and home i went with some printouts of what is dupuytrens contracture and instructions to come back when contraction begins... After the pain and swelling went away i went to see a hand surgeon with similar diagnosis. Went back to GP to get it examined with ultrasound imaging and eventually another hand surgeon, MRI and now 3-4months later it´s official, i have had DD for 4 years. Only left hand was examined with ultrasound and MRI but i can only assume both hands are the same thing. Nodule on the left hand has gone bigger after it was poked with a needle and is now about 1cm in diameter and easy to see. No cord and this is the only nodule on my left hand. I get on occasion some mild sensation someone might call pain but it´s really mild and also some strange twitching of the middle finger. There is no contraction on either hand, although the left palm feels a bit tight.

This thing is really getting on my nerves, i may need to stop climbing as it´s definately not good for the DD and even if i continue i might not be able to climb for much longer after my condition gets worse? To say im depressed would be an understatement. This stupid thing is all i can think about.

For research this site has been a great resource. I have also been in contact with prof. S for a possible consultation and RT treatment Hamburg and he has been helpful.

I just can´t make the decision if i should wait and see or go to Hamburg so any insight on this from more experienced people would be much welcome. One thing i am afraid is the possibility of getting cancer.

My option now seem to be:

1.Get RT as soon as possible
2.Wait and see, maybe massage therapy and/or cortisone injections.
3.Surgery to remove the nodules now.

I have seen some comments on the threads that a lot(some saying even most) of people never need treatment for their DD.
Is this a fact only for the folks who get it in older age and it tends to not move so fast for them to need treatment before they pass away? Is it realistic to expect that i might not go beyond nodules given my age?

Thank you in advance if you take the time to read this and for any advice you can give me on how to proceed with treatment.

Best Regards

Aku

    02/22/2015 20:39
    Seph 
    02/22/2015 20:39
    Seph 

    Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

    Hi Aku; Very tricky giving advice for a disease that seems to be different for each person so I will just try to respond to a few of your comments with my view.

    No it is not the case that people who get DD later in life don't need treatment because they pass away before its a problem. DD travels at its own pace. I have had DD and LD for more than 40 years. In my case sometimes there is no action for years then there will be periods the growth seems to be out of control and then it settles down again. For some people all they get is one lump and it stops there. My father had a lump in the middle of one palm and the ring finger bent slightly on the hand and thats all he had from some time in his 40's until he died in his 70's. I have a 55 year old brother who developed LD on one foot 30 years ago but it has not progressed.

    It does seem to be the case that the more you interfere the more active the DD and LD becomes so it is not a surprise to me that the nodule got bigger after it was poked. In my early teens a surgeon operated to remove an LD lump from one of my feet and the growth rapidly returned twice the size.

    The three options you set out all in actions. The fourth option is "do nothing". It has taken you 36 years for it to get this far. It might take another 36 years for the same thing to happen on the other hand with no progression on the first hand.

    Most important this is a good disease because it doesn't kill you but there is no cure so all you can do is manage it. My view is manage it with caution. Interfere as little as possible and ignore it when you can.

    Also you say that your climbing is definately not good for the DD. I question this. I am active in the gym and work with heavy weights. I also play tennis and do a bit of cycling. My activities are constant yet the disease is sometimes active and sometimes dormant. And I was not a sporty kid a school when the disease first developed.

    Hope this helps.

    Good Luck

    Seph

      02/22/2015 22:26
      spanishbuddha 

      Administrator

      02/22/2015 22:26
      spanishbuddha 

      Administrator

      Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

      Hi Aku

      I don't think I can add much to what Seph has said or what you have researched and found for yourself. It does appear that your DD is proceeding quite slowly? Four years between nodules, and despite perhaps your relative youth and active use of your hands. Any family history or other predispositions?

      I think I understand the angst, as I play piano, and to lose that ability would be a huge blow; but actually now for me five years after the discovery, and although I have continued use of my hands for piano, I am now prepared if I lose some ability and to manage that possibilty. So you too may well come to terms, and possibly for many years, maybe forever, you will not have any functional problem, just lumps and occasional soreness.

      I would keep a record, including symptoms, with photos, plan a course of action if things do progress. Maybe even visit ProfS, not for treatment, but the advice and knowledge he has; he might consider you too young or the condition not sufficiently active for effective RT right now. He does not always treat people he sees if he thinks it is not appropriate or ready.

      Not sure what to say about rock climbing. Like Seph I also play tennis, and am quite active in the garden and with DIY (4 daughters means I'm their plumber, electrician, handyman, etc), but I do make an active effort to protect the hands. Having said that I was showing the grandson how to get up an indoor climbing wall last week, hurt my already sore shoulder, but the hands survived.

      Best wishes
      SB

        02/23/2015 07:28
        wach 

        Administrator

        02/23/2015 07:28
        wach 

        Administrator

        Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

        I fully agree with what already has been posted by Seph and Henry (SB). Just to add a comment on rock climbing: it can actually aggrevate Dupuytren's, as Logan et al. have shown in "Can rock climbing lead to Dupuytren's disease?" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16118302 . It's impossible to predict individually how the disease will develop but yes, likely and unfortunately rock climbing is a risk factor for Dupuytren's. BTW, this seems to apply for all activities damaging the hand, for example also playing hockey or bongo drums.

        Wolfgang

          02/23/2015 17:27
          Aku_ 
          02/23/2015 17:27
          Aku_ 
          Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

          Hello All

          Thank you for taking the time to read my post and answering me.

          I was aware that more climbers might be affected by this disease compared to the general public but was not aware of the study so thank you for pointing it out to me.
          I have ruled out the option of early surgery already, i am still considering RT and have scheduled with an appointment with prof. S for mid april. but im not sure if it´s worth it for only consultation because of the cost of flying to Hamburg etc. so i am thinking of canceling it if i decide against RT.

          Steph and SB, what age were you when you got the first symptoms and what age are you now?

          I have no family history with DD, i´m not diabetic, not epileptic or liver disease, i don´t smoke(quit over 10 years ago), i do like to drink beer sometimes but im not alcoholic=) Climbing is the only one thing that would make me more prone for the disease. I used to be very active whitewater kayaker for over ten years and competed in freestyle kayaking before going full on for climbing. I normally climb 3 days a week or more but have been less able lately(down to once a week)because of devoleping golfers elbow roughly 2months before the nodule appeared(on the same hand).
          I am thinking of turning my climbing activity down a notch as quitting is not a tempting option at the moment.

          Anyhow, i have another consultation here in Finland in two weeks and i guess after that ill have to make up my mind on what to do or to do nothing at all.

          At the moment the left middle finger is feeling stiffer than normal but no contracture. Not sure if it might be a cord or my tendon that i can see under the nodule when i stretch the hand and it is freaking me out some. The MRI report only talked about a nodule though.

          Best Regards

          Aku

            02/23/2015 20:16
            Seph 
            02/23/2015 20:16
            Seph 

            Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

            Hi Aku; I first developed LD in my early teens. This was operated on as the doctors didn't know what it was and thought it might be a tumor (I grew up in a country town in NZ). The LD returned twice the size. By my late teens I had LD in both feet and DD one hand and by my mid twenties the DD was in both hands.

            I was in my early 30's before I had a proper diagnosis and discovered that there was a link between what was happening in my feet and what was happening in my hands.

            Clearly alcohol was not a factor in my first developing the disease. I have never smoked but as an adult I do like a glass or 2 of wine each day. There are members in my family that I now recognise as having minor LD and DD ailments so there is obviously a genetic link. I think it is the case that alcoholics tend to get DD not that people with DD tend to be alcoholics. I am not diabetic but I did have Hepatitis A as a child which caused some scaring to my liver and I wonder if this explains why the DD/LD is more aggressive for me than for other members of my family.

            I have also had frozen shoulder (Bi-lateral) which you will find is linked to DD. If you get frozen shoulder, as many DD sufferers do, your rock climbing and golf will come to a halt for a couple of years.

            Treatment over the years: Surgery one foot in my early teens, surgery one hand in my early 30's, first NA procedure was in 2007 when I was 54. Since then I have had NA on 6 further occasions (3 one hand and 4 the other).

            I turn 61 in a couple of months.

            Hope that all helps to give you some perspective.

            Seph

              02/23/2015 22:05
              spanishbuddha 

              Administrator

              02/23/2015 22:05
              spanishbuddha 

              Administrator

              Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

              I'm mid 60's and diagnosed late fifties although I had it before then, just didn't know what it was. I've had quite large knuckle pads since my teens, I remember trying to remove them thinking they were warts!

              You only really have one shot with RT so it is wise to pick the moment carefully. Also I wonder if there is an adverse effect on ligaments and pulleys that might be a risk to a rock climber. Just thinking out loud, so this may be rubbish. But having had RT my hands do get dry in winter, with skin splits if I don't moisturise them.

              I've had all manner of arm, wrist, hand and shoulder injuries from playing tennis, including quite nasty golfers elbow last year that caused me to stop for 3 months, and now rotator cuff and biceps tendinitis in the non-racquet holding arm. I have not noticed a link per-se between those injuries and any increase in DD activity.

                02/24/2015 19:25
                Aku_ 
                02/24/2015 19:25
                Aku_ 
                Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

                Hello again

                Thank you for your replies.
                I keep reading the various writings on the forum but it helps to interact with people and hear first hand about their experience.

                I don´t golf but climbers tend to get golfers elbow, it´s from overuse, kinda like tennis elbow but on the other side.

                New Zealand is a really nice country, been there twice a couple of months for whitewater kayaking. Mainly around south island on the west coast but also on the north island. Done some kayak surfing too with dolphins swimming around in Graymouth

                Hope to come back some day.

                I may have some more questions but ill try to relax now for a while and figure this thing out.

                Best regards

                Aku

                Edited 02/24/15 21:33

                  03/11/2015 20:00
                  Aku_ 
                  03/11/2015 20:00
                  Aku_ 
                  Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

                  Hello

                  An update in hopes someone else has had similar experience.
                  About a week ago, after a period of about two months of my left hand nodule getting slowly bigger and feeling a type of tightness increasing on my palm. In a couple of days the tightness dissapeared and my nodule seemed smaller and softer.

                  This was also confirmed by my sister who saw the nodule for the first time less than a week before(for the first time).

                  Has anyone had this type of exprience? Im seeing a hand surgeon tomorrow and after that i have to decide if im going to see professor S mid april.

                  I am concidering massage therapy and cortisone injections as an treatment option to RT.

                  Thanks in advance for any input.

                  Best Regards

                  Aku

                    06/17/2015 06:55
                    Aku_ 
                    06/17/2015 06:55
                    Aku_ 
                    Re: New dupuytrens patient Finland

                    Hello

                    A new update since my last post.

                    So, i went to see the hand surgeon, this time under public health care.
                    It was the same surgeon as whom i met earlier at a private clinic.
                    This is normal as most of the doctors work in public healthcare and also do private work.

                    The visit was not very helpful, i was asked if i would like to be referred for surgery on my hand to remove the nodule and cord. The surgeon was aware of RT but told me its only used for life threatening illness in Finland. She was also worried on the long time affects on skin and bone marrow.I have time till august to go back and get referred. After that i have to go thru all the steps needed again in order to go get referred to a hand surgeon under public healthcare(there is a rule that my "case" is open for 6 months after the visit). But, i guess it´s not a good idea to have surgery on it at this stage as there is no functional problem with my hands?
                    So i tried to figure out what to do next and decided to go see Prof. S at the Hamburg clinic. I had to postpone it a few times because of work but eventually went there mid may. For consultation only.
                    Trip was easy to make and with instructions from one of the very detailed stories on visiting Hamburg strahlencentrum found on this site.
                    My meeting was 1hr late,the clinic seemed very busy, Prof.S seemed busy and kind of in a hurry to get me out the door. So it took me some effort to get answers to my questions after the examination.
                    Not really a big suprise after reading all the stories of visiting Prof.S, he found some new small nodules on my left hand.
                    I had not noticed them before but after i know where to look i can find them. I am not sure if my palpation skills have gotten better but i think these small nodules are now bigger.

                    Prof.S told me my hand was othervise in good condition, im not failing the table top test. He gave me between 3-6months to see if the disease is progressing(i think it might be). The original larger nodule has stayed about the same but some tightness seems to be coming back. It seems to change from day to day.

                    So now im faced with the desision to go/not to go...

                    My two main concerns are:

                    1. Cancer risk over time(please any info / reading on this subject would be good)
                    2. The treatment not working.
                    3. Long time affects.
                    4. One option i am thinking about is to save the RT option to a time after surgery(if i need one at some point) if it causes a flare.

                    Also, im still hoping to find someone of my age who has gone with the RT treatment to get some insight on how it worked out for them.
                    There is one account of a person called Philip who has done it at age 35(on this site under patient experience) but there is no contact info and the last update is from 2008.

                    Sorry for the long post, hope to find some answers to help me decide.

                    Best Regards

                    Aku

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