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Radiation therapy treatment dilemma
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08/30/2009 23:10
moondanc 
08/30/2009 23:10
moondanc 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Thanks, Flora, for the idea about the photos and thanks, Newman, for the idea about using a photocopier-- excellent-- it takes me back to the days, long ago when Xerox machines first came out and people at work were goofing off, sitting on them and taking pix of their bottoms :-) I think I'll go scan them right now and see how that compares to a photocopy.

I wish I'd thought to take pictures 5 weeks ago before and after my NA procedure. I guess it's sometimes common that there is regression after a procedure but my finger already appears to be back to pre-NA status depsite physical therapy, splints, stretching and exercise. I'm still waiting for a response from Dr. Chiang on whether he will order a MRI-- I sure hope so because I don't want to start looking for another radiologist/city for RT and I want to get on with it so I can have NA on my left hand. I still haven't fond a study or explanation abot how radiologists-- other than with lots of prior experiece with DD-- figure how deep to go when using RT.

08/31/2009 00:50
flojo 
08/31/2009 00:50
flojo 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Moondanc,

I was told at Scripps that the purpose of the Ct scan was to determine how deep to send the radiation. The tech showed me the images on the computer screen where the nodules were in relationship to my bone. They only wanted to go deep enough to get the nodules but not to the bone. My understanding from the explanation (and I have no medical training so don't blame them if I misunderstood) is that a CT scan shows bones more definitively and an MRI shows tissue more definitively.

Others say that neither a Ct or MRI is necessary, that they can tell by visual examination but mostly by palpation. I think knowledge about radiation therapy for non-cancerous treatment is the most important. If they know radiation, they know the concept of how to apply it to DC. I feel confident that I made the right decision to get RT, and I had it none too soon.

09/02/2009 23:23
moondanc 
09/02/2009 23:23
moondanc 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Hi Flora,
I did a lot of research online and found a few papers and the previously referred to book that said MRIs *could* show DD (I don't want to have a CT scan because of the xtra radiation). My doc finally today agreed to let me get an MRI of my right hand. However, his thoughts regarding MRI have not changed much and his opinion is that the available studies examine a small number of patients and do not relate MRI findings to treatment planning for radiation. He also said he would be "choosing an appropriate electron energy to treat to the depth of interest. The depth is determined by hand thickness, which for the most part is consistent from human to human and thus the energy is pretty much already determined." That seems to be a little different than what Lori has reported but since RT is so new in this country I'm not sure there's any established protocol. I wish Dr. T.-- or someone else-- would do some tracking and followup studies. We shall see if the MRI makes any difference in my treatment plan. Please cross those non-DD fingers for me

Diane

09/03/2009 01:17
flojo 
09/03/2009 01:17
flojo 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Hi Diane,

RE: "book that said MRIs *could* show DD"

To me, that is consistent with what I understood from something I read - that MRIs actually show tissue better than Cts but Cts show bone better. Dr. T does a Ct. Apparently he wants to know the depth of the nodules in relationship to the bones. I still don't know that it is necessary to have either one.

I think an MRI is quite expensive. I was surprised that my Ct was less than $100.

Flora

09/03/2009 12:38
lori 
09/03/2009 12:38
lori 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Diane and Flora,

You are right an MRI is expensive. I think I paid around $1200.00 (my share) of the cost. If you look at my picture under the heading "pictures of my hand MRI to now" you can see the nodule on the MRI. You can see it as the dark spot under the bone in the middle of my hand. It shows the nodule in relation to my palm and the depth to the bone. So it cleary shows Dups. I have said before, that I am not sure I would do an MRI again, due to my cost unless it was REALLY necessary. Flora you are right in that an MRI does see through soft tissue better than a CT.

Lori

09/03/2009 17:09
moondanc 
09/03/2009 17:09
moondanc 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Quote:



Hi Diane,

RE: "book that said MRIs *could* show DD"

To me, that is consistent with what I understood from something I read - that MRIs actually show tissue better than Cts but Cts show bone better. Dr. T does a Ct. Apparently he wants to know the depth of the nodules in relationship to the bones. I still don't know that it is necessary to have either one.

I think an MRI is quite expensive. I was surprised that my Ct was less than $100.

Flora



Hi Flora (and Lori),

I'm also surprised that your CT was less than $100. I think if I were going to a radiologist with more experience with DD, I'd trust palpation and other means to identify the extent, depth, etc. of the disease. OTOH, my radiation oncologist is very experienced and also has done a lot of work with keloids, etc. so he certainly knows how to avoid bone. We shall see what he thinks after the MRI and whether it helps him any more than he thinks it will (at this point he thinks not at all). I'm just grateful he's open and amenable to my input (and that Diana did all the groundwork with him) and that Medicare covers MRIs. (and thank you to Lori for all your info on this, I'm not sure I'd pay $1300 out of pocket for an MRI in this case). Hopefully we'll be able to discover something that will add to the information pool.

Diane

09/08/2009 22:28
jurate

not registered

09/08/2009 22:28
jurate

not registered

Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

American doctors do love MRIs. We have more MRI machines per capita tham any other country and frequent use helps pay for them. Insurance usually pays, and the doctors make money. I'm not a conspiracy theorist about this, but our health care system is set up so that it reward high tech procedures.

I'm still dealing with Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center in New York City to see if they will use radiation on my Ledderhose lumps. The scheduling guy in the Radiology Dept keeps asking me detailed questions about the X-ray that my doctor took. I told my doctor, and I told the scheduling guy at MSKCC, that these lumps don't usually show up on X-ray so it's probably a waste of time and radiation to do that. But the doctor said it's just routine, they X-ray all feet before the doctor even sees the patient, regardless of what the problem is. So the guy at MSKCC asked whether I had an MRI. I said no. He was puzzled and said "Well then how was your fibroma detected?" I said "You can SEE it. It's sticking out of the bottom of my foot."

Imagine that. Using physical diagnosis and palpation.

09/22/2009 23:59
bstenman 
09/22/2009 23:59
bstenman 
Re: Radiation therapy treatment dilemma

Doctors in the USA use MRI's for fear of being sued if they miss something with a patient that might have been caught by an MRI. They lose nothing by having one done but are at substantial risk (possible career ending if they cannot get insurance) if they do not have one done.

I did not have a CAT scan done for the procedure in Germany but did for the XRT several months later in San Francisco. The SF medical center uses a different type of machine than is used in Essen and it requires more precise calibration for the exact depth at which it focuses the radiation. This approach is more expensive but probably safer as there is less radiation of the bone and other tissue beneath the fascia. Whether this added safety is worth the added expense is anybody's guess.

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