| Lost password
402 users onlineYou are not loggend in.  Login
Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule
 1 2
 1 2
09/17/2007 19:46
RonSB 
09/17/2007 19:46
RonSB 
Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

A couple of months ago, an extremely qualified hand surgeon who had been following my case for years suggested that now was the time for surgery. But I'd heard of NA and wanted to check that option out. Most things I read led me to want to schedule NA with Dr. Charles Eaton. But on the advice of my primary care doctor, I saw the surgeon again. Though he doesn't perform NA himself, he's certainly familiar with what's involved. And he's not the sort of person to dismiss NA because he would lose a patient by doing so. In his opinion, NA might be fine for the fascia in my palm, but he thought it would not be as good as open surgery for the nodule over the proximal phalanx of my fourth finger. I'll try to attach a picture of the nodule to this post:

If the image doesn't appear here, you can see it at
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7199506@N05/1397884825/
I sent several pictures, including this one, to Dr. Eaton and his office replied that he considers me an excellent candidate (his words) for NA. What do you think? Should I listen to the prominent hand surgeon or to Dr. Eaton. Thanks for your answers!

09/17/2007 20:33
Randy_H 
09/17/2007 20:33
Randy_H 

This is not an Eithor/Or proposition

RonSB,

The answer is quite straight forward. NA Vs Open Surgery is *not* an Eithor/Or proposition. It's Both/And. As in many forms of medical treatment you always start with the least expensive, least invasive and least dangerous. If the entry level treatment is not sufficient, you move up the ladder until something works. You don't start at the top.

NA is an entry level procedure, not the final option. So, you can try NA first and if it turns out that your eager surgeon is right and that NA is not sufficient, you move up to full surgery.

Ask the surgeon this. Has he ever personally *seen* the results of NA on a patient for which he was advising OS? I doubt it. If not, he's talking from theory not actual real life experience. How much actual experience with NA does he really have to advise against it? I'll bet none. Meanwhile Eaton is an expert in *both* OS and NA.

No one can guarantee outcomes. But statistically I can say this. NA is safer than OS. But...it has a higher rate of recurrence, which means statistically you would need to do it again sooner than if you had the surgery.

You pick your poison around here. But why not start with NA? Personally I've had both OS and NA. I'll avoid the OS as long as possible. If your disease is slow moving and you are older, NA may be all you'll even need, though it may need to be repeated.

NA is like getting a car tune-up. OS is like rebuilding you engine.

09/17/2007 23:57
SteveAbrams

not registered

09/17/2007 23:57
SteveAbrams

not registered

Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

I completely agree with Randy based on my personal experience. The hand surgeon I first saw on referral from my primary physician recommended surgery. I began to do research and became interested in NA. When I mentioned this to the hand surgeon he recommended against NA, saying that I risked nerve damage with this procedure. In fact, the risk of nerve injury is considerably higher for surgery, and I already knew this. So, at this point I felt that I was more knowledgable about NA than the hand surgeon, and I contacted Dr. Eaton, who is a very well-trained hand surgeon, sent him photos, and subsequently had NA performed by him on my right hand. This was almost 3 years ago - I have absolutely no regrets. Although things could change tomorrow, there has been no increase in contracture since having NA done.

Steve Abrams

10/02/2007 17:49
Sunshine

not registered

10/02/2007 17:49
Sunshine

not registered

Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

Hello there...I also went to a hand surgeon in 03.....He recommended the old regular hand surgery.....I found this forum on my own and went to Dr. Eaton...I have never regretted going to Dr. Eaton..My finger has gradually turnerd back downwards....about 90.....The N.A. IS NOT A CURE, BUT IT SURE BEATS THE SURGERY BY A LONG SHOT....

10/02/2007 17:52
Sunshine

not registered

10/02/2007 17:52
Sunshine

not registered

Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

There is no quess work here.......Surgery is out.. Go to a qualified hand surgeon that does N/.A..iF YOU HAVE THE REGULAR SURGERY DONE....N/A/ is not an option........It is a walk in the park....

10/25/2007 19:21
Indyike 
10/25/2007 19:21
Indyike 
Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

I am a 56 yr old male who began having symptoms of DC in my rt ring finger about 20 yrs ago, soon after carpel tunnel surgery on the same hand. By March of this yr, there was a 60 degree contracture so I decided to schedule surgery with Dr. Greenberg at the Indiana Hand Center in Indpls. I happened across the NA procedure while surfing and read every relevant article I could find. I cancelled my surgery appointment and left a message with the surgeon's nurse to have him call me to discuss, since NA was never suggested as an option. During our conversation, she speculated that Dr. Greenberg probably didn't consider me a candidate for the procedure. Suppose I'll never know for certain what he was thinking, since he never returned my call.
Anyway, I contacted Dr. John Mahoney at Midwest Ortho in Peoria IL, a hand surgeon who performs NA. I sent him photos and he responded immediately. I scheduled a consultation and it was understood that if appropriate, the procedure could be performed on the same visit. I made the 3-hr drive to Peoria 7 days ago and couldn't be happier. There was virtually a full release of the contracture, and in less than an hour I was driving home. The worst part was a 1/4" skin tear from where it had been puckered over a number of years. The tear seeped for a couple of days and required a gauze pad. However, I resumed near normal activities immediately, and the bandage gave way to a band-aid within 3 days. After 5 days, the band-aid came off. On this, the 7th day, the tear wound is about half the size and, at this rate, should be fully healed in another week. Compared to open surgery, this is truly a NO BRAINER. And I didn't even mention the cost savings--THOUSANDS!!! If you live in the midwest and are contemplating NA, I would highly recommend contacting Dr. Mahoney.

10/27/2007 19:36
JackStraw

not registered

10/27/2007 19:36
JackStraw

not registered

Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

I had Surgery for DD by a CHS this past Feb. Only symptom was a nodule, left pinky between MCP & PIP - bent about 20 degrees (I play guitar so it was a problem). Regardless, 8 months later I am at 60 degrees, bad scarring and tight skin along the Z-Plasty.

So now I am going to get N/A - Dr. Denkler thinks that will release me nicely. But the prior surgery means it isn't a walk in the park AND I will need a skin graft to repair the skin between he joints. I beat myself up as I should have gone for N/A first, and the prior surgery now complicates matters. But the CHS and others all said that for a "nodule" HS was the best route as "N/A was really only good- if at all - for cords". Right. I was doubtful even as I waited on the table and they were prepping my hand that day.

I am somewhat nervous about the pending N/A outcome because a lifetime of guitar playing - which is already compromised - hangs in the balance. But I will NEVER forget how lousy an experience the regular surgery was.

Go talk to to a practicing N/A Dr. first - you can always escalate to HS.

10/29/2007 19:31
Randy_H 
10/29/2007 19:31
Randy_H 

Bad Medical Advice

Jackstraw

Unfortunately your story is a typical example (and warning) for new readers of this Forum that their otherwise highly regarded CHS only *think* they know what they're talking about when it comes to NA. Many of us have had to learn the hard way for their ignorance/bias.

At the same time it must be said that NA has it's limits and Open Surgery may be necessary for some in the end. However, always check with a CHS who does *both* to evaluate your case. They are the only ones who qualified to know the strength and weakness of both procedures. You don't consult a fighter pilot regarding hang gliding.....unless he has done it himself.

You are in good hands with Dr. Keith. He has pioneered the use of doing NA through existing scar tissue and may still be the only surgeon doing this. If he can't fix it, it can't be done. At least you will not have made the mistake of taking bad medical advice twice.

Edited at 30.10.07 01:17

10/30/2007 04:29
dianeS

not registered

10/30/2007 04:29
dianeS

not registered

Re: NA after surgery

JackStraw Dr. Denkler did NA on my pinkie through the scar tissue of prior surgery. he had to make a small incision to rearrange the skin to avoid tearing and also found some dup tissue behind the nerve and took that out. The result has lasted 17 months which is more than the open surgery lasted. And he let me do follow up with digital photos. I am an artist and pinkie is more useful now than it was when all this started six years ago. You will be glad you went to Denkler.

11/06/2007 01:36
macphgw 
11/06/2007 01:36
macphgw 
Re: Surgeon advised against NA because of nodule

My hand surgeon, who performed several very skilled operations on both my hands in the 1980's, has recently added NA to his repertoire of techniques. He mpresses me as not being the kind of person to adopt any technique without thorough investigation and careful consideration -- I would describe him as conservative and cautious. He has been a hand surgeon for decades now and has had an excellent reputation, which is the reason I went to him in the first place.

The fact that he has started using this procedure suggests to me that it will soon be a mainstream ttreatment for dupuytren's in North America.

 1 2
 1 2
surgery   statistically   v=lGD9RjmFBzo   contracture   advised   investigation   procedure   savings--THOUSANDS   conservative   against   Surgeon   dupuytren-online   experience   performed   Unfortunately   contemplating   because   Congratulations   consideration   recommended